I personally liked the book because I found the plot intriguing and I enjoyed the dramatic ending. I liked how they connected the ending of the story back to the prologue and then expanded the story with an epilogue. I liked the conflict between Rufus and Dana because it was kind of a quid pro quo relationship, but she ended up having more power. Dana ended up killing Rufus when he tried to rape her, as shown in the text, “I was aware of him trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side”(Butler,260). I believe this event was the climax in the story. I think Butler placed the climax at the end of the book to create suspense and I think their wasn’t really a better place in the story for it because it wouldn’t make sense on how the story could continue. What is your guys opinion on Dana killing Rufus? Did you think it was a suitable ending for the book? Also, what do you think happened to Joe and Hagar? I predict that they moved to Baltimore with Margaret Weylin, as hinted in the epilogue.
I agree that Dana killing Rufus, was a good climax and suspenseful but I didn't like the ending that much. It didn't feel like the book really ended and I had hope in Rufus to become a good person and not like his father.
I agree this was the climax of the book. I also agree that Butler used the strategy of placing the climax at the end to keep the reader searching for the turning point. I was rooting for Rufus to change till he raped Alice then it went downhill from there. I think we all can agree that Rufus is a jerk and waiting for her to strike. I also agree with your prediction.
At the beginning of the book, I thought I wouldn't like the book that much and it did not seem to interesting but I found that I actually really enjoyed the book and found it hard to put the book down between chapters. Although I really enjoyed the book, I didn't like the ending. They spent the whole book building up Rufus to kill him off, I was expecting him to learn a life lesson, or to realize that what he was doing was wrong. On page 260, Rufus tries to rape Dana, “I was aware of hm trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.” I believe her stabbing him was justified, but I wish it had ended with a more satisfying ending and to put all the missing pieces of her family history together and to explain why it was happening to her. Do you think the author made the right choice as how to end the book? Can you think of any other endings you think would be better?
I really liked the ending of this book due to how much drama it brought to a suspenseful and dynamic book. I feel as something was going to happen but was in shock of what actually did happen, Dana killing Rufus. I think that was a moment that she needed and to show her strength. So I agree in order to progress Dana character this scene was crucial.
Rufus learning what was wrong with his treatment of black people would have been much stronger. This is because of the way the book had played out. Dana was only ever trying to change Rufus the entire time that they are together, and everything that was bad happened to Dana very consistently. If at the end Dana finally got through to Rufus, and he was able to change the way he treated slaves, then there would be pay off to the climax of the book. Its hard to understand why the author decided to take the book in a way that only ended the book with 0 pay off and Dana never received anything for the momentous effort she put in to changing the atrocities she saw.
I personally didn’t care for the book. The book spent over half the book building Rufus as this conflicted character who wants to be loved, to kill him in this way, “even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.”(260) While I’m not saying this isn’t in character for both of them, but I feel the ending was boring or even out of place. While it gets the point across that slavery is dead and the book achieves the point that today America is a much better place it equates a character who just didn’t want to be alone to a system that was put in place to prevent revolts and get farm work done.
The book was ok until the end. Much better than reading "Tonto And The Lone Ranger Engage in Fisty Cuffs in Heaven" though. Had the book delivered a more heartfelt ending to the commentary on slavery, maybe having Rufus realize his own wrongs, then the book would be good. An author (Octavia Butler) cannot build up something about how atrocities based on race are bad, and then have the second main character die still believing it was ok.
I agree with #1 Student AF, this book was good but the end was a little iffy and kind of a moshposh.. But the book does get the point that slavery is done, in agreement with Jon.
I agree, this book took way too long of a time to explain the characters and how they developed, every time Dana traveled back to them. This books idea was kind of out there as in some people may have a hard time to follow along and comprehend what the books main idea is trying to get across.
At the beginning of the novel I did not think I would like this book. It started out very dynamic and confusion. Yet as the book progressed and I began to like it more and more. Butler beautifully intertwined parallels between the slavery era and todayś society. Even though society has progressed, interracial marriage is still a somewhat taboo subject in the 1975. Dana and Kevin struggle with this discrimination when Kevin discusses with Dana how his sister, “ didn't want to meet you (Dana), wouldn't you have you in her house (110, Butler). Like Kevin and his sister Tom and Rufus had the same interaction stating that Rufus not have, “wasted all your money on that worthless girl when discussing is purchase of Alice (Butler, 161). This shows that no matter the time period discrimination still takes place. I loved how Butler intertwined these two sets of characters and their relationships to show parallels in time periods. I think this book gives meaning to society to show that we need to reconsider what we consider taboo. Today in 2017 we still look at interracial marriages as not a common. Last year a cheerios commercial received uproar due to it depicting an interracial family. This shows how society still has lots of progress to achieve. Do you agree that society still views interracial marriages still somewhat taboo? Why or why not and how can we change this mindset.
I agree that Butler intertwined the parallels between slavery and present society in a really nice way. Also, I agree with your point that society still has a lot to achieve when it comes to discrimination and I think that is why Butler compared these two time periods.
Personally I do not like this book. I'm not all for books that have terrible issues that have happened to people in real life. The book also just showed Rufus changed and bad discussions. Reading this book really didn't give me any entertainment and wasn't interesting. Others may like this book and that is totally okay, its just not for me. In this book it does show issues that happen in our society today, and their is more punishments and laws put into place so these things done happen, otherwise the offender will be punished. This book just showed what life was back in the 1800's.
It is also really relevant to know our past and what happened and to see how far we have come. Also a lot of the topics and situations that happened then still happen today, it's just not as noticeable or extreme.
I agree there were a bunch a terrible issues that had happened that no one should have to go through, but I do think that this book is a good book to open our eyes on how live was back in the 1818's and so on.
I agree there were too many issues in the book. This book was a bit too graphic for me as well. I completely agree that this boo is not for everyone and this was a part of history that we can change, and also horrible to read about.
I agree that there was too much going on in this book. Different uncalled for plot twists that made the book extra. There was a lot of random stuff going on that wasn't needed. For example, how much was described when Dana was in pain when traveling back and fourth.
For me, the books ending ruined it. The premise is fine, and can be great if done properly. One event within the book ruined everything though: "I twisted sharply, broke away from him. He caught me, trying not to hurt me. I was aware of him trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side" (Butler 260). The time we spent developing Rufus was wasted, we never got a better man. Its as if the book is saying there was nothing that could be redeemed out of these people. I feel that this is a very hypocritical thing. The entire book Dana goes forward hoping to change Rufus' view of black people; his current view being that there are no redeeming qualities of a black person. Then this book makes a 180 and says that there's actually nothing redeemable about the white people. It feels like a theme would have been much stronger if it had Rufus make a connection that his treatment of black people was irredeemable instead of Dana killing him. I believe that this would be stronger because then he could change himself and use this new found knowledge to his advantage.
I really enjoyed reading this novel and I did because history really fascinates me. Since this book took place in, “1976” and “1818” and throughout the 1800s, but this book showed you the perspective of Dana who’s a black woman and a slave in the 1800s, but it really went into the personal experience they went through and the way they felt. Also, our in class discussions were really good and get me to a deeper level of thinking through the book, which I think helped me enjoy it a bit more because I got to see the way other people thought about a particular situation.
I personally did not like this book, the way Butler describes Dana time traveling to a slavery time period, and how she combines a science fictional theory of time traveling with a depressing period in time is a bit confusing and not needed in this type of book. “The room began to darken and spin. “Oh no,” I moaned. I closed my eyes against the sickening dizziness.” (Butler, 58). This quote is an example that butler uses to describe how she has Dana time travel in the book, The way Butler describes how Dana time travels makes sense. It just does not fit with this depressing era in time. In class some of my book club partners thought the book took an interesting spin with this science fictional aspect and the non-fiction twist. Then a couple others thought it was too confusing and an over dramatic plot. I think butler tried way too hard to draw her readers attention in the book that she missed the whole purpose of what this time period was about, slavery. She should've focused on the same characters and maybe how Dana could change the game of slavery and make it better for her and the others on the plantation.
I agree that it does not fit with the depressing era during this time. There were a lot of plot twists that went on that didn't need to be involved/mentioned. When reading this book, I did not find a purpose because it was just so confusing.
Overall, I did not like the book. It took longer than half the book describing Rufus’s personality to fully understand why he is the way that he is. Myself and my group members thought that the ending was terrible. Instead of a lead on sentence, the ending could be defined as a lead on ending. There was more than there actually needed to be making it extra. “Even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.” (p.260). Times were different back then. The book described very well how times periods have changed so much and how America is a much better place.
I personally was intrigued but also a bit confused when it came to the purpose of the book Kindred ending the way that it did. I think that the dramatic ending is fitting for a novel that is full of suspense and on the edge of your chair excitement. I enjoyed the novel because of those reasons and because I had never read a book about slaves from that type of perspective. I also liked the intrigue that continued throughout the entire story and the lack of a dull moment. I was interested in the way that Dana is portrayed. She is a strong women in modern times and then a slave in the past and at the end of the book in the slave era. Even she was a slave she acted as a strong free women. The perspective in the story is my favorite part about it. What do you guys think about the book? Why did the author end the book the way they did? What was the ending supposed to mean to the readers?
I personally liked the book because I found the plot intriguing and I enjoyed the dramatic ending. I liked how they connected the ending of the story back to the prologue and then expanded the story with an epilogue. I liked the conflict between Rufus and Dana because it was kind of a quid pro quo relationship, but she ended up having more power. Dana ended up killing Rufus when he tried to rape her, as shown in the text, “I was aware of him trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side”(Butler,260). I believe this event was the climax in the story. I think Butler placed the climax at the end of the book to create suspense and I think their wasn’t really a better place in the story for it because it wouldn’t make sense on how the story could continue. What is your guys opinion on Dana killing Rufus? Did you think it was a suitable ending for the book? Also, what do you think happened to Joe and Hagar? I predict that they moved to Baltimore with Margaret Weylin, as hinted in the epilogue.
ReplyDeleteI agree that Dana killing Rufus, was a good climax and suspenseful but I didn't like the ending that much. It didn't feel like the book really ended and I had hope in Rufus to become a good person and not like his father.
DeleteI agree this was the climax of the book. I also agree that Butler used the strategy of placing the climax at the end to keep the reader searching for the turning point. I was rooting for Rufus to change till he raped Alice then it went downhill from there. I think we all can agree that Rufus is a jerk and waiting for her to strike. I also agree with your prediction.
DeleteI also agree that was the Climax of the book, when I was reading I honestly didnt think she was going to kill him
DeleteAt the beginning of the book, I thought I wouldn't like the book that much and it did not seem to interesting but I found that I actually really enjoyed the book and found it hard to put the book down between chapters. Although I really enjoyed the book, I didn't like the ending. They spent the whole book building up Rufus to kill him off, I was expecting him to learn a life lesson, or to realize that what he was doing was wrong. On page 260, Rufus tries to rape Dana, “I was aware of hm trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.” I believe her stabbing him was justified, but I wish it had ended with a more satisfying ending and to put all the missing pieces of her family history together and to explain why it was happening to her. Do you think the author made the right choice as how to end the book? Can you think of any other endings you think would be better?
ReplyDeleteI really liked the ending of this book due to how much drama it brought to a suspenseful and dynamic book. I feel as something was going to happen but was in shock of what actually did happen, Dana killing Rufus. I think that was a moment that she needed and to show her strength. So I agree in order to progress Dana character this scene was crucial.
DeleteI think Butler made the right choice in how to end the book because I believe the only way to end the book was if either Dana or Rufus died.
DeleteRufus learning what was wrong with his treatment of black people would have been much stronger. This is because of the way the book had played out. Dana was only ever trying to change Rufus the entire time that they are together, and everything that was bad happened to Dana very consistently. If at the end Dana finally got through to Rufus, and he was able to change the way he treated slaves, then there would be pay off to the climax of the book. Its hard to understand why the author decided to take the book in a way that only ended the book with 0 pay off and Dana never received anything for the momentous effort she put in to changing the atrocities she saw.
DeleteI personally didn’t care for the book. The book spent over half the book building Rufus as this conflicted character who wants to be loved, to kill him in this way, “even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.”(260) While I’m not saying this isn’t in character for both of them, but I feel the ending was boring or even out of place. While it gets the point across that slavery is dead and the book achieves the point that today America is a much better place it equates a character who just didn’t want to be alone to a system that was put in place to prevent revolts and get farm work done.
ReplyDeleteI agree, I hated this book, it was not interesting to me and It was so hard for me to keep reading.
DeleteThe book was ok until the end. Much better than reading "Tonto And The Lone Ranger Engage in Fisty Cuffs in Heaven" though. Had the book delivered a more heartfelt ending to the commentary on slavery, maybe having Rufus realize his own wrongs, then the book would be good. An author (Octavia Butler) cannot build up something about how atrocities based on race are bad, and then have the second main character die still believing it was ok.
DeleteI agree with #1 Student AF, this book was good but the end was a little iffy and kind of a moshposh.. But the book does get the point that slavery is done, in agreement with Jon.
DeleteI agree, this book took way too long of a time to explain the characters and how they developed, every time Dana traveled back to them. This books idea was kind of out there as in some people may have a hard time to follow along and comprehend what the books main idea is trying to get across.
DeleteAt the beginning of the novel I did not think I would like this book. It started out very dynamic and confusion. Yet as the book progressed and I began to like it more and more. Butler beautifully intertwined parallels between the slavery era and todayś society. Even though society has progressed, interracial marriage is still a somewhat taboo subject in the 1975. Dana and Kevin struggle with this discrimination when Kevin discusses with Dana how his sister, “ didn't want to meet you (Dana), wouldn't you have you in her house (110, Butler). Like Kevin and his sister Tom and Rufus had the same interaction stating that Rufus not have, “wasted all your money on that worthless girl when discussing is purchase of Alice (Butler, 161). This shows that no matter the time period discrimination still takes place. I loved how Butler intertwined these two sets of characters and their relationships to show parallels in time periods. I think this book gives meaning to society to show that we need to reconsider what we consider taboo. Today in 2017 we still look at interracial marriages as not a common. Last year a cheerios commercial received uproar due to it depicting an interracial family. This shows how society still has lots of progress to achieve. Do you agree that society still views interracial marriages still somewhat taboo? Why or why not and how can we change this mindset.
ReplyDeleteI agree that Butler intertwined the parallels between slavery and present society in a really nice way. Also, I agree with your point that society still has a lot to achieve when it comes to discrimination and I think that is why Butler compared these two time periods.
DeletePersonally I do not like this book. I'm not all for books that have terrible issues that have happened to people in real life. The book also just showed Rufus changed and bad discussions. Reading this book really didn't give me any entertainment and wasn't interesting. Others may like this book and that is totally okay, its just not for me.
ReplyDeleteIn this book it does show issues that happen in our society today, and their is more punishments and laws put into place so these things done happen, otherwise the offender will be punished. This book just showed what life was back in the 1800's.
It is also really relevant to know our past and what happened and to see how far we have come. Also a lot of the topics and situations that happened then still happen today, it's just not as noticeable or extreme.
DeleteI agree there were a bunch a terrible issues that had happened that no one should have to go through, but I do think that this book is a good book to open our eyes on how live was back in the 1818's and so on.
DeleteI agree there were too many issues in the book. This book was a bit too graphic for me as well. I completely agree that this boo is not for everyone and this was a part of history that we can change, and also horrible to read about.
DeleteI agree that there was too much going on in this book. Different uncalled for plot twists that made the book extra. There was a lot of random stuff going on that wasn't needed. For example, how much was described when Dana was in pain when traveling back and fourth.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteFor me, the books ending ruined it. The premise is fine, and can be great if done properly. One event within the book ruined everything though:
ReplyDelete"I twisted sharply, broke away from him. He caught me, trying not to hurt me. I was aware of him trying not to hurt me even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side" (Butler 260).
The time we spent developing Rufus was wasted, we never got a better man. Its as if the book is saying there was nothing that could be redeemed out of these people. I feel that this is a very hypocritical thing. The entire book Dana goes forward hoping to change Rufus' view of black people; his current view being that there are no redeeming qualities of a black person. Then this book makes a 180 and says that there's actually nothing redeemable about the white people. It feels like a theme would have been much stronger if it had Rufus make a connection that his treatment of black people was irredeemable instead of Dana killing him. I believe that this would be stronger because then he could change himself and use this new found knowledge to his advantage.
I really enjoyed reading this novel and I did because history really fascinates me. Since this book took place in, “1976” and “1818” and throughout the 1800s, but this book showed you the perspective of Dana who’s a black woman and a slave in the 1800s, but it really went into the personal experience they went through and the way they felt. Also, our in class discussions were really good and get me to a deeper level of thinking through the book, which I think helped me enjoy it a bit more because I got to see the way other people thought about a particular situation.
ReplyDeleteI personally did not like this book, the way Butler describes Dana time traveling to a slavery time period, and how she combines a science fictional theory of time traveling with a depressing period in time is a bit confusing and not needed in this type of book. “The room began to darken and spin. “Oh no,” I moaned. I closed my eyes against the sickening dizziness.” (Butler, 58). This quote is an example that butler uses to describe how she has Dana time travel in the book, The way Butler describes how Dana time travels makes sense. It just does not fit with this depressing era in time. In class some of my book club partners thought the book took an interesting spin with this science fictional aspect and the non-fiction twist. Then a couple others thought it was too confusing and an over dramatic plot. I think butler tried way too hard to draw her readers attention in the book that she missed the whole purpose of what this time period was about, slavery. She should've focused on the same characters and maybe how Dana could change the game of slavery and make it better for her and the others on the plantation.
ReplyDeleteI agree that it does not fit with the depressing era during this time. There were a lot of plot twists that went on that didn't need to be involved/mentioned. When reading this book, I did not find a purpose because it was just so confusing.
DeleteOverall, I did not like the book. It took longer than half the book describing Rufus’s personality to fully understand why he is the way that he is. Myself and my group members thought that the ending was terrible. Instead of a lead on sentence, the ending could be defined as a lead on ending. There was more than there actually needed to be making it extra. “Even as I raised the knife, even as I sank it into his side.” (p.260). Times were different back then. The book described very well how times periods have changed so much and how America is a much better place.
ReplyDeleteI personally was intrigued but also a bit confused when it came to the purpose of the book Kindred ending the way that it did. I think that the dramatic ending is fitting for a novel that is full of suspense and on the edge of your chair excitement. I enjoyed the novel because of those reasons and because I had never read a book about slaves from that type of perspective. I also liked the intrigue that continued throughout the entire story and the lack of a dull moment. I was interested in the way that Dana is portrayed. She is a strong women in modern times and then a slave in the past and at the end of the book in the slave era. Even she was a slave she acted as a strong free women. The perspective in the story is my favorite part about it. What do you guys think about the book? Why did the author end the book the way they did? What was the ending supposed to mean to the readers?
ReplyDelete